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A serious problem from the wrong end of the stick

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There is a serious problem and IMHO it is being looked at from the wrong aspect.


It is not that certain portions of our society have devolved into complete hatred for authority figures.  There are bullet resistant plastics / polycarbonate and I cannot see where police vehicles cannot have side glass replaced with polycarbonate.

and a flip voice box so if you need to hear a complainant you can without giving up protection.


I recall when the democrats pitched a fit during the first gulf war that our "BOYS" did not have proper protection / armor and after they were all on board for the war they turned it and made the Republicans responsible for it, when in fact both parties were gravely at fault.


We are in the same situation now police have always been a target for criminals only until myself I have yet to hear a solution there are also ballistic helmets high collar ballistic vests and even ballistic ball caps. now we can talk about all the other equipment like clipboards gloves larger trauma plates.


Vests are rated by levels I, II, II-A, III, III-A, IV as of now most departments only issue for street police level II or IIA  since we have had our officers be front line in the War on Terror including having to defend our soldiers at Fort Hood I have known for a long time that the level of protection needs to be increased and now we need to enhance vehicle protection.  Another issue is that new vehicles are not the equal to previous and their ability to deflect or stop bullets SUCK so a full panel window and inside the door eliminating moving glass altogether.  There are also thin films that may be a good to bolster windshields.


To many departments use inferior internal shielding from arrested persons police have been shot from the back seat enough to consider this a area to enhance as well.


I hate to sound like the preamble to the bionic TV series, " we have the technology blah blah blah BUT WE ARE NOT USING IT !  police can use tax credit and buy departments can ask for money and or alter replacing current models by time with high collar level III A Now this may not be all positive as the better vests are heavier and add more bulk.  I am old enough to recall the resistance to "vests" and the arguments that it inhibited movement etc etc.


We still have to broach the subject of police actions and acts, recently I watched a video where a officer punched a woman in the face if I can't do it neither can the police (she did not hit the officer before the event) and I have been forced to watch a person that is obviously given up or is passive and they are attacked and a over the top physical take down was unnecessary now if they were dumbazzes before a little refund on time trouble and effort is in order.


I am appalled that plain talk has been replaced by political correct speak when asking a person to comply first ask then demand and then tell them your gonna get your azz kicked or die you know like when you go to a car was you have standard  mo' better and executive,  the executive has more hands on.

I have had experience with violent criminals and find some are into S&M so it is a fore gone conclusion that your in for a fight so you need to tenderize them well before you put them in the box.  I like the old shoot on sight / wanted dead or alive and shooting a fleeing felon if we had never gotten so wimpy and all these different states having such lame rules we would all be on the same page and criminals would be on the run not police and lawyers to defend them IMHO.

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I work for a company that uses a lot of polycarbonate, and back in my construction days, I installed a LOT of bulletproof glass. The reason that it is not installed in squad cars in that the polycarbonate of necessary thickness to stop a handgun bullet is very heavy and very expensive, plus it's usually an inch thick or more. It takes a lot of work and expense to modify a squad car to accept that's not just a quick retrofit like screwing on a light bar and splicing wires.

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this could be done as a "police package" and as everyone is fond of saying competition drives down the price (not in anything I ever wanted)


as far as an inch thick no problem you do not need weatherstrip track rail electric motor wiring etc etc so the offset in crap in the door helps the overall cost.  I have seen where less than half inch stopped 45 acp slugs I am just as sure it would work against non magnum rounds 1 inch would probably stop most all pistol but, do we need to go that far ? threat level IIA stops most all pistol but there are rounds ( I will not mention) that can defeat level II & IIA that is why the added trauma plate.


If we are worried about cost take it from government staff like mayors and their staff cut paid vacations holiday pay for non emergency "MANAGEMENT  LEVEL" working in an air conditionsed office polishing a chair with your azz is not a threat level worthy of extra pay days off or all the other perks.


Cost is relative do we want to pay the family death benefits for years, Brain drain loss of experienced officers all the training invested equipment cost other than the vehicle ?  this is not a linear cost it is the costs that are not obvious I am sure the insurance companies will weight in once the see the cost versus loss  and if a company sells at cost it keeps their employees working and some added tax benefits from the state and local government if they are so concerned with American JOBS,


Drug money confiscations are suppose to pay for all this so it would not impinge on our tax dollars.

Fact is if we really take it to the illegal gangs and since they could be considered foreign terrorists subverting local law threat to government and citizens spreading toxic chemicals if this was your local business they would arrest everyone and imprison them.    so it adds a couple of thousand against 50,000 insurance and death benefits replacement training and equipping a new officer and time to get them up to speed ? retrofitting is a matter of swapping a door and that door needs NO electrical and can use a old school KEY what they are to lazy to use a key over their lives ? what next battery operated handcuffs.  and if a cop car need a security system either the bad guys have lost the fear of the law or judicial system is failing all of us (and it is) 


As fa as light bars they cause most accidents it is like a porch light attracting bugs all the drunks see it and run into it. most the light need to be forward a single color back light to mark it is a police vehicle that flashing crap verges on causing a seizure blinds you as you pass.  I remember when cops had RED or BLUE thats it thats all now it looks like a flashing fruit salad and people still run into them so it ain't working cost more and we could use that money to PROTECT our police and it offers stealth if you have a fruit salad flashing bars lights and a cop paint job seems to me your attracting attention here we have ghost effect paint jobs in grill and rear deck lights on a lot of vehicles I like it  you should follow the law not because you see the cop but because IT IS THE LAW.


It may seem a low percentage of police but as long as this type of terrorism is effective it will increase as far as I see we only need this in target cities gradually increasing to other major cities and state police and further as needed it is not cost it is a defense against an effective war on the police if we do not act now we will have to later as we devolve into a 3rd world entity like Mexico. I for one do not want to see Army and Marines Federal and secret as well as local police like in Michac'an Sinola Guadalajara, Matamoros and other Mexican states  is coming here now we have other Cartels from Peru etc etc the Drugs are so powerful that we could well face suicide attacks from dope zombies.


Either we accept that there are forces that are willing to die and kill for what they want or we can ignore the obvious What really bothers ne is the total exclusion of the identity of these killers are they mooslim are they white black Hispanic or some new death sect of moonies we are like mushrooms being kept in the dark and fed sh*t.  if we want to save money most of the country has no police violence so they don;t need vest ? I do not think anyone would say they don't.


Here is another consideration we are in a war with China as we speak we are being blackmailed they hold a lot of our debt other countries have leverage on certain commodities and others have agreements with each other and have held meeting without us to foster a new world defacto currency we are not out of the woods yet other forces are at work to destroy this country and many are working from the inside bought and paid for with foreign money.  there are many ways to topple a giant we need to get ahead of the ball on this one or loose the game.

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Having been ON/IN "the wrong end of the stick" in a patrol car for a few decades in my past career, I can attest that "bullet-proof" never is.

Nothing is "bullet-proof", that can be used by any officer/deputy/Trooper on a daily basis. While bullet resistant products are out there, my personal preference is for the IIIa level, with soft trauma pads. While those pads help reduce the blunt force trauma affects on your body, you still will go down hard when shot, but you will survive and that is all that matters.


In the "old days" we all carried backup handguns, usually a small five shot revolver in the off-side uniform pocket. Those old uniform pants came with or without a "holster" pocket sewn into them, allowing you to have a hold of your BUG(backup gun) with your off-hand in your pocket and no one knowing how fast you could deploy that backup. This system saved my bacon on three different vehicle stops(which I loathed doing).

Not letting one's guard down, IS still the best method of protection against an ambush. Losing your situational awareness for any reason gets you hurt or worse. Same with the civilian population. You must be aware of your surroundings and who belongs and who does not.,

 I tried to choose my vehicle stop final locations for MY personal safety and awareness and NOT the vehicle being stopped.

Now, I try to firmly practice conflict avoidance.  Not out of fear, out of common sense, as it is the only way I can control MY personal environment for safety. Hope this helps.

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As you stated nothing is "bullet proof"  but "they" always tell us, "if it saves one life" --- unless it is an unborn baby or a police officer ? But that's another thread in itself.


A piece can be attached to the window frame alone inside the window or both like everything else it ain't perfect but it is better than nothing.


years ago I was off the ship channel in a dive / bar not exactly a family friendly drinking establishment or a mickey rat pizza joint anywho someone decided to shoot a guy at the end of the bar through the door thinking it was glass and it was polycarbonate a handful of 45 slugs some popping noise and banging when it hit the poly and they ran off the poly was stretchedthe bullets were stuck in it but did not parr through.  no I realize had these been more powerful  they would have pierced and struck but with vastly different results.


I see where they want to make killing an officer a hate crime NO we have enough special needs children all lives matter or none making special cases because the victim is an officer makes non official citizens lives worthless literally this is the problem live murderers a life for a life unless in extenuating circumstances and that is for a jury to decide mandatory sentencing has done squat  our prisons are filling up and we are releasing them not because they paid their debt but because we either cannot afford to keep them or because the prisons are full up and that is no way to protect the public or officers.  A dead POS does not commit more crimes it is high time we took back the jury and kick out lawyers from stacking the deck with hand picked jurors put forward the facts not a school play as to what either side thinks facts not fiction or surmises DNA fingerprints vehicle tire tracks video REAL EVIDENCE. I had to watch the O.J. trial what a waste of a year as hard as I tried every channel and most was theatrics how they missed it but there was her blood on the inner door of his bronco all B.S.


Police are not so perfect that laws need to totally encapsulate them as another being every case should be on it's own merits and to keep it fair if the charge is unjust the accuser is to be jailed and it is up to the jury time and conditions so that keeps the accusers at bay if they know they are liars keeps the police respectful of the citizenry and the judicial and hired guns in line if anyone gets an upper hand it screws up the whole system.  We have a government for the people by the people not BUY a lawyer for the justice system to make prisons a paying business.


courts should be local in the area where the crime was committed I'll bet my bottom dollar that Chicago citizens in the area where much of this murdering was happening with people of the area let them deal with the problem if they want to let them go or live in fear let them be responsible for their community so no one else can be accused of creating the problem one off is throwed off only in a gang problem is there allowed a change of venue and still that is up to the local community not a bunch of lawyer foo.  I also do not like in chambers sessions hiding anything in a trial is a crime if your a witness or a juror but not if your a judge or a lawyer ? again we have a double standard too many times a person is convicted because citizens were not given all the information.


Either We the people or blow it off and bit@h about how it gets done also jury pay is pathetic if a sorry azz lawyer gets his pay what about the rest of us we too sorry to be respected ? each to their own daily base pay scale no more no less fair is fair it's a job and if you screw it up you get a penalty as in time to cool your heels to a real sentence.


All this falls back to personal responsibility we have ceded our power to others because we are lazy and do not wan to be bothered or bruise our conscience in judging another and now it's bitting us in the posterior altruistic flower children 60's crap is for moronic children time for people to grow up and take responsibility if a juror lets a person off and they commit another crime they should be told so they understand their part in allowing crime to flourish and harm others in their neighborhoods.


This is all easy people just do not want to change but they want to gripe well it is time we prove you can't have it both ways. just like these protesters arrest them (if they vandalize or harm people) and throw the book at them and put in the news who what they did and the sentence like a road sign for the stupid. and make them share the cost to rebuild / repair if it does not cost it has no value, winners that follow rules need to get the prize stupid should feel the pain of eating crappy jail food and a big dent in their wallet and if they don't want to go peaceable maybe a dent in their head.

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When the good decent people of this are public, start to REGULARLY ventilating thugs and thugettes for their predation, reported violent crime will indeed become almost non-existent, with the exception of Chicago-style predation, that being thug-on-thug violence. Even then, innocent children are caught in the crossfire of these worthless humanoids.

I do believe that allowing for "natural selection", to become far more prevalent, thugs will cease to be a societal problem.

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