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Guest zen811

300 AAC Blackout

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Has anyone had any experience with the new 300 AAC Blackout? It looks like ammo is a bit scarce right now but when it is available it looks to be fairly affordable and a great option to have for more knock down (matches the 7.62x39 ballistics) using an 5.56 AR platform and simply changing out the barrel. Apparently you can even use 5.56 brass for reloads.

 

http://300aacblackout.com/

 

http://www.beyond556.com/bboard/content.php?131-Best-of-Shot-Show-2011

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Being so new, I dont have any experience with it. I have a bit of experience with 6.8mm and 5.56mm, and if the company's claims are true, than it may be a good round. The 6.8 is my dream round, but the same problem ammunition availability is present there as well. I would be interested to here from others on this matter, it could be interesting.

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looks like it has potential much like the 6.8 however to echo josh, how much is a box of this going to cost and how available will it be vs more common rounds?

 

I look at ammo and weapons like this, I not only want common proven ammo for my weapons to use i also know that it is what everyone else is using and if the time comes I have scavenge or even pick up ammo off of corpses from firefights chances are it will fit in one or more of the weapons I have, plus common stocked up ammo supplies make for better barter items if need be

 

now I'm not knocking this round granted it doesn't look like a lot of third party ballistics tests have been done yet since it is so new. Hopefully someone with some experience on this round will chime in and educate us on it.

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The 300 AAC Blackout is a development by the Advanced Armament Corporation to produce a .30 caliber round that is ballistically (near) equal to the AK round 7.62 x 39. The 300 AAC is basically a 7.62 x35 which can be adapted to the AR platform (which also the Chi-Com round can be, too). I would be the last to deny that a .30 caliber bullet is more functionally powerful in terms of terminal ballistics than any .22 caliber aka the .223 or 5.56. In theory and indeed on paper the 300 AAC looks to be a very interesting new wildcat round. In practice for us, it holds little value if and until it is commercially available in mass quantities. Right now it is strictly a reload situation and that could be problematic to sustain under Bug Out conditions.

 

Others would argue that the 300 AAC is a fine solution to a non-existent problem. Remember the 10mm auto, the 5mm Rimfire, the 7mm Express Remington (280) and any number of great but unnecessary cartridges? For us gun nuts they are great to play with, but for example I bought a new Ruger 77 in .358 Winchester over two years ago just because I have always wanted one. It took me over two years to find one box of ammo finally at a local gun show. Would I want that rifle as a primary, secondary, or even a 3rd tier SHTF backup weapon? Nada.....

 

I am sure it is not being suggested to drop everything we have to jump on a 300 AAC bandwagon. Stock up your .223 ammo and AR platforms, add an AK if you must have a .30 cal or better yet supplement the stash with a quality .308 battle rifle for real impact....pun intended.

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Great points all and I agree!

 

Everything I've seen so far with this round places it way above the 6.8 and 6.5 in my opinion. It costs around $12 for a box of 20 rounds supersonic 125 Grain (the subsonic 220 grain rounds are around $21) and uses all the same hardware (including magazines) you already have in your AR 5.56 variant. If you could swap out barrels easily then all you would have to have on hand is a 5.56 barrel (about 1 lb) and you could move to that round if/when your 7.62 x 35 ammo ran out and switch over to 5.56/.223. I used to patrol with an extra upper in my pack anyways (about 3-4 lbs) for long range work while patrolling with my 10" upper so it's not that far fetched that I would do it again for a backup (300 AAC for all purpose and 5.56 for a backup upper).

 

The problems I see with 7.62 x 39 (standard AK round) are (from the AAC webpage):

• Reduces reliability of feeding in AR Magazines

• Reduces Magazine capacity

• Cartridge taper induces considerably higher bolt thrust-

exacerbating the AR Bolt's weaknesses

• Requires a larger Bolt Face which reduces Bolt Locking Lug strength-

exacerbating the AR Bolt's weaknesses

Limited projectile selection

• 0.311" diameter not a common option in most modern bullets

 

I believe there are similar problems with the 6.8 and/or 6.5 with the cartridge taper and larger bolt face problems.

 

Plus being able to use the 5.56 magazines, cartridges and bolt as well as everything else (minus the barrel of course) is a HUGE plus.

 

It will be interesting to see where it ends up in the long term, whether it takes off or fizzles. Since it's not a proprietary round like the 6.5 Grendel I imagine it has a fairly solid chance and I know downrange there are already some pretty hardcore proponents of the possibilities... apparently there have been some pretty heavy verbal commitments from some major ammo and rifle manufacturers that they will start producing their own versions of the 300 AAC Blackout.

 

I already have my 7.62 x 51/.308 platform, 7.62x39, 5.56, .45 and 9mm which I recommend to everyone first and foremost since they are the most common rounds and possibly/arguably the most readily available for the long term in a TEOTWAWKI or SHTF situation... but for my branch out into the next realm I am considering but not rushing out to buy a 300 AAC Blackout upper/barrel until I find out a bit more and watch what happens... definitely not a "must have" but a "gee that would be sweet!"

 

I hope it's all the hype and more and I hope it is here to stay.

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Plus with the AR15/M4 platform you are weighing in at about 5 lbs without optics and other added goodies. That is about the limit that is comfortable for sustained carry at the ready no matter what kind of shape you're in. Just like 30-35 lbs is a good goal to get your BOB down to if possible for sustained movement (ref: The Soldiers Load and The Mobility of a Nation).

 

The AK is great and fairly inexpensive alternative... I just hate the mag change ergonomics although if I trained more with it I might get past it..

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Zen- Now you're on to something I missed with the alternative upper. Dang...I coulda had a V-8! This would also negate issues I was thinking about in terms of the .223 bolt and extractor set up. With a complete and ready to roll upper, that is all set up, proven and ready to rock. If you ever get your hands on one, or if somebody posts a live U-Tube on it please report it here.

 

I am just guessing on pure speculation wondering if AAC is testing the waters for an AR based .30 caliber for military and LE applications? There has been some noise for a couple years about US military wishing they had an option there. Last I heard they were keeping the M4 at least for the near future (read budget constraints). They have to factor in training time and costs as well.

 

Good info.

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Just found out about this today... got me salivating.

 

Colt CM901

 

Gonna have to start a new thread for it and maybe re-adjust my financial targeting...

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Interesting concepts. Zen811 thank you for the reasons for this round. Up until your posts I saw no advantage to it at all. If you want 7.62X39 performance, get an AK or a Ruger Mini-30. Your arguments give some good reasons for the round.

My biggest problem with the concept is the modular idea in and of itself. If I have 3 uppers that I use on one lower, I don't have 3 rifles, I have one rifle that can shoot 3 calibers, one caliber at a time. It is like the printer, scanner, fax machine all rolled into one. If an electrical storm fries my fax machine through the telephone line (recently happened to me, GRUMP!) then I've also lost my scanner and printer. Under the "2 is 1, 1 is none" mantra, an M4 with any number of uppers is still only one gun and a failure in the trigger group leaves you with several expensive clubs!

That said, the possibility of being able to use several flavors of scrounged ammo is very attractive. Most here know I don't like the AR/M4 platform for a variety of reasons (check out the http://survivalcache.com/the-best-survival-rifle-carbine-ar15/ series for my copious (some would say verbose, but they're just unfair minded) comments) but as to the odd ammo requirement, if you like the platform/ammo combination then get it. The only added requirement. assuming you mean this as a survival weapon, is that you buy enough ammo for the mix that you never, ever need more. You either have enough on hand or reload capability or both.

I'm lusting in my heart for an M1 Carbine. I love the thing but recognize ammo is non-existent post TSHTF. That means I have to have all I'll ever want/need if I am going to use it as a survival weapon. For me, that means around 2000 rounds with a re-order anytime I get down to 1500 rounds left. That is my choice, yours could be different.

I don't think this is the weapon for me; I'd like to shoot it of course but I think a Ruger Mini-30 is more likely my rifle. Just my not so humble opinion.

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Everything here continues to expand the thinking horizon. I catch myself inside my box which is I am the only shooter in the family and will be the only one. So Capt's point about not having 3 rifles by just amassing some uppers is well taken. Probably why I have multiple rifles with a load of magazines. I have worked through the strategy of minimizing the number of different chamberings I would rely on. I have settled on the .223, .308, 9mm, and 45ACP. I dumped all the 40 stuff and only maintain 12-gauge in shotguns. You can only buy so much, maintain so much and shoot so much. As further back up I have rimfire and a couple deer rifles.

 

Zen, what is the Colt CM901? Stuff comes on the market faster than I can keep up with. One trip to the SHOT Show would blow your mind.

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