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P210SIG

When it comes to survival prepping, what's the biggest hurdle for you.

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I find it very hard to find good reliable, hard working , GOD fearing honest people that you can trust.

In my lifetime of personal experience I've met proclaimed to be Christians that were versed in the Holy Bible, but their actions in works & action are sketchy.

I've had past friends that have stolen & betrayed my trust in them.

People in general are lazy & can not be trusted.

I'm a Baptist Christian & was babtized on April 22,1984 to be born again.

I've seen Catholic Christians do unchristian like behaviour to fellow neighbours where I live.

Me personally I find it very hard to trust people nowadays.

Members in my survival group are all Christians.

So let's hear it from you, what's your biggest hurdle, when it comes to survival prepping.

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the trust thing is a biggie one, who to trust?

 

I was in a group of groups and we let in a former police officer who turned out to be a nut and that ended my participation along with a few others...

 

but this doesn't mean you don't try to find like minded people...

 

I search online all the time looking for people in my area...the problem is I always find the nuts instead of the normal people... :(

 

i'm a non-denominational Christian baptized in 2007... :)

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I'd like to just find more people who take this seriously (like not a haha joke). Maybe I actually know more people who do prep, but they don't say anything and neither do I. I find that prepping more than your car's jumper cables is not something people should broadcast. We certainly don't tell very many others. None of our neighbors know. So the mystery is how to go about finding people who are trustworthy, hard working, and have skills and/or stuff to bring to the table without wearing a sign that reads, "I have everything I need in times of a disaster" on my back.

 

Plus, I just have no idea about how to set up a prep community??? Take out a newspaper Ad??? Haha.

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all of you have struck on the big problem TRUST I am the one you speak of when at times people that are don't always act like it.

It is hard to be perfect in fact so hard it can't be done I get snappy and all the other things of normal man, frustration tired and numb.

 

I have come to the conclusion that I will have to start alone and eventually if things get bad others may try to barter but the main event has to happen first and thin the herd and things have to settle out before any interaction on my part I am afraid.

 

I am fairly sure all of you are fine people but that does not mean we can get along for days on end add in children animals chores and cleanliness issues and everyone becomes strained add in the world around changing and most will not thrive as a group IMHO.

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For me ACTIONS are all that count. I can trust an honorable atheist a lot further than I can trust a self-proclaimed Christian that lies, cheats and steals. I've watched too many preachers that were no more than con-men bilking people for their money while proclaiming their Christian faith and devotion. Then you find out that like Jim Baker with the 700 club he his living in a house with real gold bathroom fixtures and living like a billionaire while little old ladies are eating cat food so they can send him 5 dollars.

 

A REAL Christian doesn't TELL you that he is a Christian; they SHOW you how a Christian should live. My Mama was a Baptist , My Dad was a Methodist and I was raised in the Methodist church. Our little church was a sort of odd place for many years. We were almost kind of non-denominational. We had several couples that were divorced Catholics and as such were not welcomed in their normal faith. We had people that just didn't fit anywhere else. LOL we even had one wonderful old man who had been “churched” out of the Baptist Church. He had been an alcoholic and was thrown out for being a drunk. He finally went the AA route and beat it but never forgave them for ditching him when he needed them the most.

 

Being the bottom of the Methodist food chain and being small we got the new and the old in the way of preachers and for 10 or 15 years it worked and we prospered. Then they sent a man that in my opinion was not even a Christian. His sermons were filled with hate and loathing for ANYONE that didn't toe the line that HE set. He scared the crap out of my little girl pounding on the pulpit and screaming about how people were flushing thousands of babies down the toilet every day. How divorce was a sin and meant you were damned and would go to hell. He was one of those that would have joyously burned people at the stake for even the smallest of variance from HIS policy. He KILLED my church. It is not a Korean church. We worked and built it and then the Methodist church killed it and sold the buildings.

 

My first cousin married a man that spent most of his life “saving” Baptist churches. He would join the church and pretty soon the church would start growing. Some times it took only a year some took a little longer but eventually they would “save” the church. That means that they, him and his friends, would have enough votes to take over the church. They would fire the preacher and then bring in one of THEIR charismatic preachers and basically throw out the people that had built that church. To me he was a thief! He never built a single church he let others work and built it and then he would “save” it.

 

Christian is a WORD. I've had a lot of baptists tell me that I was going to hell because I wasn't born again. I just smile and go on knowing that I didn't judge them and so was ahead in the game. If you are an honorable, loving and charitable person I don't need any specific words to tell me whether you are a good or bad person. I watch and then KNOW. Anyone that judges based on words is easily mislead whether it is words from a salesperson, a preacher or a politician.

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Everyone's going to hell, it's GOD that decides who he chooses that he wants to be in heaven with him.

Way too many people talk the talk, but don't walk the walk with their actions.

I've met a lot of them in my life time. Bunch of bull sh!tters.

My club had a American that moved to Canada & joined our shooting club.

He said he was in the marines, so one day I asked him to do a complete strip down of a M16, M4, C7, AR-15 all basically the same rifle.

He didn't know how to do it, since that day he has never shown up at the club again.

Made a laughing fool of him self.

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For me one of the biggies has to do with the philosophy of survival. The last thing that I want around me in a survival situation is some bozo that wants to play GI Joe bada$$. This is survival, it isn't a game and you don't have winners and losers. All you have at the end is the Living and the DEAD. One of my problems with all these military type weapons is that they will get you killed if you let them make you think that you are 7' tall and armor plated. If you walk down the middle of the road with all your fancy weaponry acting like a fool that is just too tough to mess with some old fart like me is going to shoot you at a couple hundred yards with a beat up old Nagant and take your stuff away. You HAVE to have a grip on the idea that you are NOT in a war. there will be NO medivac, reinforcements or supply drop coming your way. I don't want to assault anyone! If I point a gun at you I am going to kill you. I want a real gun to do that with. Compared to even a 30-30 a 5.56 is only a little more deadly that a 22lr. A lever action 357 mag has almost three times the stopping power of a 5.56. To me the only smart way to win a battle is to not fight in one. I will be a Rattlesnake. I won't come to you; I won't attack you; I will hide from you and I WILL kill you if you won't leave me alone. I don't want some dummy around who wants excitement or is going to hunt or stir trouble up.

 

On the flip side if you expect me to let you hang around me you had by God better have my back. The first time you bug out on me you better just keep running because you just moved from ally to enemy in my book and it will be better for you if I never see you again.  I can and will get along with nearly anyone as long as they don't mess with me or mine or betray me or mine. If you do that I will treat you just like a Copperhead laying on my front porch daring me to come out the door.

 

I don't want someone that is overly agressive and who is all into drame. You are not going to make my group into a constant fussing mess. You are not going to be lazy and expect everyone else to work like hell to feed you and keep a roof over your head.

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True Damn

 

This year I have watched my garden get fried or flooded in the last 2 years it has produced half of what it normally did anyone counting on a garden is going to be very upset when like last year too damn hot this year too much rain.

People that do not raise animals or grow will not be able to conceive that failure is an option if we go without power for a long time how will people water their precious plants ? livestock themselves.?

 

I have lived where either you got your water from a body of water or a well or used a hand pump water weights just over 8 pounds a gallon it takes at least 5 gallons a day to really live OK not like we do now.

wash shave coffee or tea drinking water cooking and I do not mean in the way we cook now then washing up the dishes cleaning in general and still not having a real bath or shower.

People have no real idea of how much work it is just to have or get water if there is no electricity.

 

In history if we had even limited electrical  power we could have been in space before the middle ages it is only with the industrial revolution where we have been able to grind grains for food store food longer transport food and manufacture in mass quantities drugs to save life we have only had penicillin since the late 30's and before we had for a short time sulfa drugs people died like flies.

 

25% of people today would not be alive if not for medications and technology as well as our educational system you are handcuffed by not having power and communications what children take for granted is exactly what make them able to be waster unthinking carefree and stupid.

my father and mother worked from day light till dark at some task before that people did not read as much as there was not time or light burning the midnight oil was not just a saying.

 

The Aladdin lamp produced such a much better light than a common coal oil or kerosene lamp and was more efficient  it was another innovation that allowed people to read before the light was too dim or too costly and fuel had to be moved from store to home and lamps filled.

back in the day many people died from accidents with liquid fuel.

 

I remember we had a 5 gallon can of kerosene and we had 3 oil lamps and a couple of miners lamps we had extra wicks and then we had cigarette lighters we had Ronson or Zippo lighte fuel we had a 5 gallon can of gasoline and a ground tank that held a couple hundred gallons as well we had a tank for diesel cases of grease a 30 gallon drum of motor oil 5 gallons of powdered soap

 

we had one overhead light in each room and a table lamp for reading a entertainment console  it had a radio record player / phonograph and if you were lucky a TV and it was likely black & white I remember having a personal phonograph it was a hand wind no batteries it only played 45RPM

and you had to have an insert to center the record (never quite understood that) al the others did not need one.

 

If you remember this your old ------

 

200px-45rpmadapter.jpg

 

your older if you remember this ----

 

2847.jpg

 

 

Glass chimneys had to be washed or else the light was dulled by soot on it.

in it's day it was the only real reading light all there would strain your eyes and promote bad eyesight.

Funny how wikipedia had no idea of what an Aladdin lamp was LMAO it used a proprietary wick and system it cast more light than anything before it.

 

a larger version was in a cradle hung over the kitchen table or on a wall scuction / placard sconce.

 

I remember a hand brace and bit  before electric drills were cheap and it was easy to get power to a location.

I have used these to drill into poles and mill lumber on remote locations.

 

Bit_and_brace.JPG

 

 

If you do not know what a pritchel or hardie hole is or what it is for your woefully lacking in your ability to survive well without electricity.

 

I am not as old as it may seem but I have lived and worked with men old as Methuselah I can remember having to pack a mule to get to the location 

or going in on horseback as a vehicle would not get there or if it did if it had a problem you had to walk out and the speed was not that much different because of terrain.

 

I know how to survive I have done it numerous times not forever but for spans of time weeks months under trying times but not like the scenario we are bantering about more severe with less defined enemies uncharted social and ethical waters murky and dark no I would say I have a shot at survival for a short period of time but not for years at some time things would have to get back to some level of civilization.

I do not see us going back to the stone age or even the 1920's as then only populated places had electricity and rural meant 90% of all the area considered the U.S.A. I would have liked to have seen a satellite shot of that earth.

 

Everything we have today is due to the first the water mill that started it then industrial coal and oil in tonnage and then the American spirit I know it came from God other may try to dispute that but why had every other civilization paled in our light assembly line production roads and vehicles they had this before us and yet even of we were not first we beat them because generally we were all in.

Everyone wanted the train roads bridges tunnels medicine doctors teachers schoolhouse and we built churches every 10 miles as every town had one.

 

now we seldom build churches the ones we have are dwindling or becoming mega-churches built on false teaching we hacve removed God from all things and as we have we have sunk ever deeper into depravity, murder, thievery, abortion, self mutilation tattoo and body art and grand delusions that we are somehow other than by the grace of God America is the leader the power and guiding light to the whole world.

We have all the knowledge of the ages at our fingertips LITERALLY and like a bunch of apes what do we do with it do we all together attempt to rise above hatred contempt pointing fingers gossip lying stealing bullying everything is a T-shirt slogan bumper sticker or a tweet.

 

Sorry folks we are one step away from disaster what may facilitate that is anyone guess but if we fall china and Russia also have the Internet and they are not so fussy about working their people to death slave labor or using captured people as slaves,

We have given away all our secrets of manufacturing and technology there is nothing that any other country cannot copy or make a copy of but they do not care about the masses Chang Kai Shiek killed 60 million Stalin killed 40 million Pol Pot killed 1/3 of his country if Africa did not have the problems it does there would be over a billion people there.

 

we have as I have stated many times the Enron of the world we want to buy & sell but not build or mine we want to create it on a computer and have the pacific rim countries build it and cry when they counterfeit or copy it and sell it without giving us our cut.

Today if you invented the next big thing it life span is less than 18 months before it is stolen and duplicated and sold around the world intellectual property is the one thing you cannot protect an idea once made and sold once is stolen sometimes even before it can be out into production.

 

Moor's Law predicts and in fact I think he was less optimistic he stated 2 years to double we are going faster and as with all thing that go fast eventually they hit the wall or loose control like a high speed wobble there is no way to correct it in order to win we must go faster  73,734,000 iPhones since 2007 how many people did it take to make just shy of 10 million phones a year ? how much of our infrastructure is dedicated to communications in weight in tons of plastic steel telephone poles satellites pipe copper silver gold platinum !!!!!!!!! and continue until you have named all the elements and all the labor fuel food water and everything else that comprises the technical world if at some point we can no longer sell each other a haircut then exactly what will happen everyone thought miniaturization was the holy grail now tablets are taking over the phone market.

 

We cannot convert everything into phones and tablets we cannot all survive on buying and selling Ideas at some point we must instead of working out at the gym go to do real work.

The reason why there are no jobs is that Americans do not want to do real work (in general) the real working population has dwindled to a shadow of what it was in the 1950's mechanization has taken a lot and exporting manufacturing  cheap imports made by people who live off of 20% of what it takes an American to live.

 

Well enough of this novelette my spell checker is about to have a fatal error.

I am not the smartest person in the room but I think I can see beyond myself and the moment I understand the greater good and the lesser of two evils and compromise is what the other fellow wants you to do.

God is into right and wrong compromise is not written in the stars it is mathematic and exact either you follow his rules and His design or it will not work PERIOD there are no shortcuts no getting over or shooting the angle we work in the parameters set by God we cannot alter gravity we can work with it we can use it I think we have built anti gravity machines and yet it is because we have it to work with,  something had to be before everything else was,  we only utilize it.

The periodic table is incomplete and always will be standing on a flat plane we can see 11 miles the earth is 24,000 miles in circumference approximately for every hill there is another for every planet yet another and galaxies and another even if we knew 99% of everything it does not mean we can eliminate death war hate or hunger we have not so far and I know WE never will in a hundred years will will be standing up to our knees in garbage and sewage the seas will be plastic pellets floating in a sludge all water will taste like urine and that is the best prediction that or 3/4 of us will be dead and all the water will smell & taste like rotting corpses gee what fun.

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Oh memories of the good old days.

I still have a few of those yellow inserts for my 45 records, they are sitting next to my Dual turntable record player.

I've shown them to my children & said that the 45's and 33's records were the original CD's before CD's came about.

Still have 1/2 a dozen kerosene lamps which I inherited from my parents.

The hand crank drill, I consider it to be the original cordless drill. Have about 8 of them now.

The last one I got at a yard sale for 25 cents, this past summer.

As to your post their Snake, I agree everything you have mentioned.

The younger generation don't know how good they have it, until the water taps stop running & the hydro shuts down.

Like you said, in a mater of days a lot of people will be dead and gone when a major event happens.

Memories of the good old days of the 1960's I truly miss.

Yes I'm a old fart is what you younger folks would be calling me, & I'll take it as a badge of honour.

Been around the block more than a few times.

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I was born in 1965 in rural iowa I remember some things like our neighbor still harrowed his field with mules, I remember gas was 55 cents a gallon, I remember 45's, I remember the old pop up cash registers

I remember when TV had only 3-5 channels and was black and white, hard candy was still 1 cent, what was to most fascinating was Benos(dept. store) had these mechanical lines that ran from the cash register up to the ceiling

and across it to a room that they used for checks and such it had a little box they would put the check in and attach it to the line and away it would go, I rmemeber the first computer...I remember the old sandwich vending machines they had. I remember having to go out on to the runway and climb aboard the plane...I remember Christmas pagents at school and spankings...I remember everything being closed on sundays

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snake it was mao that killed 60 million not Chang Kai Shiek

Ops  sorry I get my mass murders mixed up your right ....

I actually have one of his little red books around here somewhere got it from a "forced" true believer back in the day.

I remember when they would run through the streets waving them looked like a sea of blood ... no they did not have a state sponsored religion they had Mao and everyone had to have a book and HAD to be able to quote it,  now ain't that better than Christianity LOL.

 

I hate to remember that part of my life, but having a hang over and wishing those church bells would stop ringing now I wish I could hear the sound again,  I remember smoking in the jury box,  5 & dime stores and lunch counters.

crisp white sheets peddle pushers teased BIG hair LMAO counter checks and gas stations had FULL service. steel cans or glass bottles and church keys no pop tops ........man so many things I miss--- I hate you wally ... made me remember LOL and thanks too wally sometimes I forget the good parts,

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Memories are all that SHOULD keep us from repeating the same mistakes over and over again. It sadly is a very underutilized ability for most people. They say that hind sight is 20/20 but that is only true if you stop and actually THINK about the things that you have observed in the past. Often times you will make a mistake several times before you spot the ROOT cause of the mistakes. I've done this with picking friends a bunch of times until I just sat down and analyzed the problems and figured out something that my Dad had TOLD me was true 40 years before.

 

Aladdin lamps are GREAT. They provide more light for about the same, or less, fuel and don't smell so much. I have a couple and also an OLD but good Ideal kerosene heater that will also do some cooking. I usually buy K1 from a farm supply and it costs less. It is not in a container. You bring your own and they pump it in just like they do gasoline. Imagine what gas would cost if you bought it in cans and jugs. Needless to say it is a savings. My gas is in red 5 gallon cans and my K1 is in yellow ones.

 

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Snake,

Glad I'm not the ONLY one who "hates" our pal, Wally! Oh, he IS a rascal alright. Memories!

 

As for who to trust: I find that (MY)trust is issued more than it is earned. I like to watch and see the

character of a person PRIOR to issuing that trust. I like to see them when the chips are down, as well as see how they respond

to the chips being in their favor as well. I HAVE been dissapointed more than once. However, I find that in waiting and watching,

my trust can be issued then earned,as I expect the trust in ME, to be issued then earned in return.

Integrity, is somehting(I feel) that you either have, or you don't. No integrity? We aren't going to be friends, ever.

If you have personal/moral integrity and courage, we ARE going to be friends, even when we don't agree on politics,

religious beliefs, politics...(OK, that last one is a stretch anyway!)

I find more in common with you all than a lot of my current "neighbors", and I HATE you guys for a variety of reasons, mostly

your constant evoking of MEMORIES!!

All kidding aside, I can find more in common with people of integrity than anything else. Heck, even MommyLiberty

has integrity and she still puts up with we curmudgeonly crochety, (and negative) types. Maybe there IS hope

for us after all?

If you don't have integrity, you aren't going to be Christian or a moral person at all. Just seems to always

work out that way in the long run. While I beleive in Christ as my personal Savior, I am FAR from being a true disciple in my

daily speech(curse far too much-especially while driving), and allow myself to get negative when forced to listen to the

political scum-elite. So, I've got a LOT of work to do STILL!

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id say the most difficult obstacle to prepping ive seen and experienced is those who try to get over on others.. i wish they'd stop and really think about what they are doing and saying.. so you know a little about prepping, yet you come off looking like a know it all... its okay to know things, really, but listen to yourself.. a wise man sees, a boastful man brags and an idiot ..well you get my drift. quit being a pain in someones backside and become a blessing to them.. give help as needed and beware of those who are easily fooled.. use discernment in dealing with others and sometimes its wiser to keep quiet and know when its time to speak up... end of sermon...  also ive had trouble finding some items. a welders hammer and a stave knife..i had them at one time but they disappeared when a crackhead broke into the shop looking for tools to pawn ..we have to manage somehow...

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Great idea Bob, only some do not know what questions to ask. or they regurgitate faulty information then get incensed if someone questions it.  What is worse is that it is only faulty not wrong, there is a real difference between prepping for a short term problem and a issue that may take some time to work out,  I think "we" have a certain responsibility to offer another observation.

 

We have all put in what needs to go in a Bug out bag, that is wholly dependent on region of where people will settle after a major event. but if there be no major event all this gear ought to be useful otherwise and last.

 

I have seen some real bad ideas or ideas that dead end water is one of the most misunderstood and the one any of us only has 3 days to figure out and as that time ticks off none of us will have better eyesight motor control or clear head to consider alternatives to extract/ find it. even survival shows do not or cannot relay all the information people need to arm themselves.  Example people are taught to find shelter and water OK people see a "cave" or is it a mine start ? some would not know to ask and why there is a difference and dangers.  The water found in some mines has arsenic lead and mercury some mine sights are poisonous / polluted. If we do not cross talk / exchange ideas here how could that benefit a person without experience ? 

 

I know what your saying and appreciate all you have said but by accident pearls of information lay in every sentence if one digs deep enough if all any of these sites are is new or mildly experienced or I lived a week in Cancun without a bottle opener crowd and retelling misinformation that is not helpful IMHO.

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always, forever, everywhere, everything, everybody,  the problem is money. If you have enough money, you can BUY time. If you dont have to work, you have time to prep. If you REALLy have money, you can pay somebody to do most of your prepping for you and you can pay people to teach you and force you get fit, etc.

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