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kevin

spanish mauser in 7.62x51

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I've got the new/old gun itch again. Already owning the 03 Springfield, mos in nagant and Enfield 303, I've decided it was time for a Mauser. After a ton of research I came across the m1916 Spanish Mauser in 7.62x51. There is a ton of varying options on what ammo is acceptable for this rifle....let's here what the view is here.

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Was lurkin' around and saw this I decided to put my 2 cents in

 

http://home.comcast.net/~gavinsw/guns/castbulletmilitaryrifle.pdf

 

too much has been said either way so in order to keep it simple make this a cast bullet rifle using "The Load" from C.E. Harris

 

You will not exceed any pressures that have been beat to death in hundred of B.S. sessions on this rifle.

 

a cast bullet of 180 grains moving at any where from 1,200 to 2,000 FPS is as deadly as anything on the market LEAD KILLS

 

in more ways than one,

 

I would not fire commercial Ammo especially not mil spec 7.62X51 the many manufacturers / countries that produce it use different powders

 

and some have pressure curves more like a spike this is what would create a problem and since I or anyone but those that have

 

pressure test equipment or can extrapolate from chronographic data ( and I consider this the SWAG "scientific wild ass guess" method )

 

as a mauser barrel is military stepped,  and pressure in the chamber area can handle X and the step 2 can deal with X and then step 3

 

now add in summer temperature and certain aspects of compression of the powder and you may have a nasty experience.

 

"THE LOAD FROM C.E. HARRIS  as far as I can find is low pressure well under comercial pressures accurate when adjusted to

 

the arm it is going to be fired in and NO I repaeat NO chamber is exactly the same or the throat so each rifle is like a person

 

an individual with likes and dislikes issues problems and with that said most all can be overcome.

 

I would cast bullets from type 2# lead 170 or 180 grain bullet with a reliefe for a gas check and size them 309

 

if you have problems with leading and you should not but if so use lynotype or just add some to #2 to make it harder.

 

off the top of my head 1 pound of lynotype and 20 pounds of lead is #2 alloy very good for most pistol for rifle 1 pound in 10

 

for me or if any leading I just cast pure lynotype and or a gas check depends and use brass or copper gas checks aluminum

 

has had many complaints about accuracy I don't know why and I am not going to bother as copper or brass checks are not

 

that much different in price for the value of being able to hit the mark IMHO

 

and using "THE LOAD" data I would change bullet depth / length try to seat it close to the rifling if it needed it

 

read more on this in many cast bullet sites.

 

here is the pay off you can shoot way more as your using less powder and your only limited to how much lead you have

 

etc.....

 

I cringe at all the horse sh*t about mach 4 bullet speed in the mini cooper of ammo the 5.56 you need speed to overcome

 

light bullet weight not so in calibers that can fling 100+ grain bullets like 243 / 6mm and up using lead you want a longer

 

heavier bullet than what you would normally shoot in jacketed and you will find that at mild velocities these longer heavier

 

bullets stabilize well and hit hard enough to take medium and large game given the caliber bullet weight and velocity is

 

compatible

 

another fantastic plus is reduced recoil and noise and you can still make a 200 pound pig take a dirt nap.

 

clean the bore very well get all the copper fouling out (clean untill patches come out like they went in)

 

work up your load and when you get it to where you can hit a handball or a grapefruit at 100 yards your good.

 

many rifles can do much better groups but for hunting a group as large as your spread hand will work,

 

and THE LOAD  works for most all military rifles that were made to fire double base / smokeless powder

 

also look in Lyman's reloading manuals older ones have more loads for cast bullets.

 

some powders are 296 4198 4227 red dot blue dot green dot unique bullseye H110 and I have seen some of the new

 

pistol and shotgun powder have loads posted on the internet.

 

Always use safety precautions like wear eye protection I wear shooting / driving gloves.

 

I have a mold that cast 248 grain  8MM's add a 4 grain gas check  now that is one wicked javelin even at 1,000 FPS

 

that is 682 miles per hour and that will turn innerds into jello and that is not an opinion it;s fact. power comes from

 

retained bullet weight and especially if it remains / stops in the target super sonic speed bullets usually pass through

 

loosing that edge and if they started out light to begin with unless the wound channel or the shock wave is severe

 

enough your game may run far enough to loose them.

 

I am a fan of DRT ( dead right there) pulling up in the truck and load them screw all that tracking drama and I don't have a

 

recipe for horns hooves hide or eyeballs so head shots are good and no meat loss.

 

the old black powder loads in centerfire rifles took all the game on the North American continent 45-70 was 1350 FPS

 

405 grain lead bullet and animals today are not as large like the giz and elk that teddy rosevelt hunted.

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While I do not own one at present, (M-N man myself), I DO have a close friend that was given one as a present. We had to clean the crap out of the barrel, lots of crud was in there from who knows what. took the bolt down and cleaned it thouroughly, then we started to "guess" what caliber it was. Spanish markings, no caliber designation, so OFF to the gunsmith it went. Came back with an "excellent" rating on the chamber, and the caliber is .308

So, I purchased some commerical ammo for him, based on the gunsmith's(custom rifle builder as well) reccomendation and off to the range we went.  That particular rifle is accurate even with ion sights, the stock is a "semi-custom" build, (read: hand job by the previous owner), and seems to present well with the current owner.

Seems to be accurate and "reliable" so far....I would strongly reccomend that anyone pursuing one, read Snake's above post and commit it to memory, just in case. It's applicable for all "surplus" style/type rifles.

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I forgot to mention that there are loads for buck shot / a single lead shot when loaded into a rifle case make a

 

super quiet small game hunting round for under 50 yards it may take turning over some rocks on the net but a

 

internet search will provide eventually information and data.

 

ONE WARNING  there is a anomoly called "ringing of a chamber" this is when a powder basically detonates due to

 

various reasons one is to little powder in a case it appears that there are powders better suited for buck shot loads

 

like Unique/ 4227 /H110 and some others.

 

Ringing is a bulge that usually occurs in the base of the neck of a bottle necked rifle case and it is a problem

 

from theat point on this bulge will cause extraction problems as brass that swells into the bulge hangs the cartridge.

 

Powders are suppose to burn like a rocket exhaust burns not explode or detonate as this causes a pressure spike

 

spikes are hard on or break parts OP rods on Garands and M14 rifles have been bent extractors blown etc.

 

This never has to happen reading and understanding the steps and Powders to use and keep within the boundries

 

make sure there is a starting load and a maximum sounds simple but if what your reading is a max load

 

most people find that a mid range load is the most accurate in cast bullets and less punishing / less recoil.

 

Mid range is deceptive but cronographed loads of 1400 to 2000 feet per second, most shooters seem to call

 

1800 FPS the magic mark where accuracy and ability to take medium size game come together.

 

As far as I am concerned a bolt action beater with a good bore is the rifle to use cast bullets in.

 

Beater is a relative word most rifles with issues can be sand blasted and blued to look retro cool

 

stocks can be refinished and better looking parts installed just make sure you don't have a museum piece

 

worth money as is before you start reworking the rifle.

 

Back to buck shot loads considering the fact that 22 rimfire is expensive it may return to some level of normal

 

but that has "0" to do with the fact it could happen again maybe tomorrow it could get worse than now.

 

Buck loads might be your only option to hunt silently and cost effective BUT this means you have to think ahead

 

have primers a selection of powders and molds because they are not going to fall out of the sky when you really need them

 

you have to have tested and formed an accurate load in cast bullets and buckshot etc maybe accelorators are more your style

 

22 cal bullets in a sabot launched from a 308 loads and sabots are available on the net and you need a special bullet seater

 

I have considered this with reduced power loading also because in the end all I need is a hunting round I can afford or have

 

no guilt for wasting a bullet worth gold on a squirrel.

 

if you have a single shot  small case .224 cal rifle consider a 22 cal pellet with only a primer if this works then you either have to have a

 

reserve of pellets & primers or get a swager to make your own from pure lead pellets.

 

Too much of firearms conversation becomes a testosterone fueled fist bumping session when it comes down to will this put meat on the table

 

I may be in the minority but I do not like the hunting shows today I never like to take life and I am not one who asks forgiveness from the

 

life I take because I would not unless it was needed, I hunt to augmnent my diet as in eating meat raised with unknown additives

 

all the time and the difference in taste I choose to hunt and fish, and trap.

 

All the giggling and spiking the football after killing a majestic __________________ fill in the blank is wrong any animal is majestic in

 

my mind, I could not make one can't do what they can, survive with no fire or tools and only their wiles.

 

Since I have not won a lottery and prices are only going to increase at an exponential rate I look for alternative ways that does not

 

empty my wallet and not knowing when the supply of reloading supplies will resume to pre gungrab levels.

 

Although a new war may not be wanted we may end up in one or many and that could draw down the amount of civillian ammo

 

companies could spend time on as military contracts mean a lot of money more than hunting and target shooting.

 

The other speedbump is price numerous reasons could drive comodities like lead copper and brass to new highs

 

anyway it goes I think we will see new normals on pricing, or a not so depressing depression where your money is devalued and your

 

basic needs require all you can make attacks on coal and CO2 can explode prices on everything.

 

Prepping is and always has been part of the human condition to have enough for any situation retirment funds are prepping for

 

either our health or other effects of time or mandated or forced retirement but these same people that scoff at Preppers must think money

 

is the answer as most that do push back on prepping focus on financial concerns than on hand comodities and food.

 

I think they are both important but if your resources are limited you have to work within them IMHO.

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I hoped someone would understand my thinking wally.

 

well since I broached the subject I figure I needed to find some information on the web about subsonic and low velocity loads for

 

full size rifles I am sure people out there could post information on similar loads for small bore calibers.

 

three pages of interesting reading history could repeat itself so if you read between the lines of todays headlines it seems some want to

 

do what was done then IMHO.

 

http://guns.connect.fi/gow/arcane1.html

 

http://guns.connect.fi/gow/arcane2.html

 

http://guns.connect.fi/gow/arcane3.html

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