Sign in to follow this  
Rapture333

Good Attributes Of A BOV?

Recommended Posts

What do you look for in a bug out vehicle? Why? For me, I don't believe driving around in a camo truck will be a great daily driver, I believe the secret into bugging out is remaining low key. Get out of the city, but don't wave around a big red flag for criminals who decide you look prepared, or if martial law kicks in you don't want to be one of those domestic terrorist preppers do you? http://www.shtfplan.com/emergency-preparedness/terrorism-update-fbi-targets-preppers-and-preparedness-supplies-in-latest-bulletin_08112011

 

Regardless, I feel that if the SHTF, it will happen in two ways. A slow but unraveling process, where WROL is just a fantasy and government has unleashed the floodgates of martial law. Theirs roadblocks, increased crime, protests, however life continues as "usual", just more interesting. Your vehicle should be low key enough not to set off any alarms. Maneuverable enough to perform emergency maneuvers, push away abandoned cars, drive over curbs, escape a pursuing vehicle, and maybe sometimes go off roading <-- This will happen 5% of the time.

 

Another situation would be total collapse, a category 5 hurricane, complete economic collapse, SHTF has turned into explosion at the waste treatment plant, whatever the case. This is where it might be time to role out the APC and zombie hunting machine.

 

Attributes I would look for:

* Able to clear curbs

* Good gas mileage (not a 10-15 mpg civilian tank)

* Metal bumpers for pushing cars

* 2WD for defensive driving (maneuvering, emergency U-turns) , or 4WD for off traction

* Ability to exit quickly and hold gear inside(no coups)

* Good for daily commutes, especially if you live in the city

* Grey man vehicle (nothing that screams I'M A PREPPER!)

 

Additions I would make:

* Safety tint added to windows

* Fuel siphon

* Extra gas canisters on the INSIDE (Preferrably full and stabilized)

* Jumper cables

* EDC or BOB

* Handgun (Have you tried shooting out the window with a rifle?) + Taser or OC Spray (Whatever the situation calls for)

 

What I'd look for:

* Jeep Wrangler Unlimited SUV

* Honda CR-V

* Toyota Land Cruiser or FJ Cruiser

* Sedans with high ground clearance (ex. VS Passat 5.7"/Suzuki 5X4 Sport 6")

* Used armored civilian vehicle XD

Edited by Rapture333

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've got a stock 2005 Wrangler Rubicon. It will drive over anything, but the BEST mileage I get is 15 3/4 mpg. Not much room for extra stuff if you have more than 2 people. For one person it would be great though. The rear seat comes out for more room. I would suggest buying one with a hardtop and full metal doors because the suspension is beefier than the one that just comes with a soft top and half doors. Then sell/trade the top and doors and buy the lighter stuff. Add a 4 inch lift and 35 inch tires, jerry can rack bumper, hi-lift jack and a heavier front bumper. Strap some fire extinguishers to the roll bar. Get rid of the carpet and spray truck bed liner.. Dampens sound and actually does make the body a bit tougher. There is a product (for off roading thru branches and limbs) that is basically a plastic shield that fits over the windshield to keep it from shattering or just replace with a plastic safety windshield.

There also used to be a kit at www.4wd.com that allowed you to mod a Wrangler into a pickup.. Brutish looking thing!

All that being said, I'd trade my Rubicon for a beefed up/hardened 1980 or '81 CJ-7 Laredo in a heartbeat.

No computer, simple straight six that will run even when low or almost out of oil. Easy to repair and you can salvage parts off damn near any old vehicle you may find. The original Jeeps were built by EVERY car company during the war and AMC continued using Ford and Chevy parts. With a CJ though, I'd only put a 2 or 3 inch lift and 33 inch tires on it due to a narrower base. Mileage is pretty bad with a CJ, but I didn't pay attention when I had one since gas was only 86 cents.. The all steel body adds weight, but there are fiberglass and/or aluminum body kits available which will help.

Edited by Hossfly

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey Rapture,

Drop the CRV. The 4wd is for wet paved roads or gravel at best. My CRV did give its life to save mine when i got hit by an 18 wheeler. Just not a serious 4x4. now i drive a 7000lb- 15mpg- suv that blends into the background very well. its my daily driver as well. i traded less mpg for more safety. I lost 5mpg. Ton of room. Had a lady hit me in my suv as she attempted to change lanes. her 2900 lb sedan was totaled in a ditch. i got a scratch on the chrome portion of my front bumper. Atlanta traffic is a great test bed for BOV survival !!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Awake your right, depending on the situation, say things don't go all that bad, I think the CR-V would be just fine. Also I'd like too add the 2 WD Jeep Liberty to the list. Great for defensive driving, can go over curbs, might be a little weak on the off roading, but it really depends on your environment. If I lived up North where it snows every winter and the roads are awful, or if I lived in a place with a lot of open land with loose dirt, get 4WD.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Guys

Some great thoughts here, but how bout a bit of food for thought.

 

Of course I am one of those who looks to the worst case scenario, and plan to survive for more than a few weeks/months. Naturally like most I hope it doesn't come down to that, but with my luck if it could, it would. LoL

 

And keep in mind I am a mechanic.

 

First, consider fuel. In the case of a long term event fuel will be hard to come by, added to the fact today's gasoline doesn't have much of a shelf life. 12 years ago I was at a Briggs and Stratton seminar, at that time they estimated the shelf life of gasoline you buy from the pump today at 6 months before it starts going bad and can cause serious problems. Diesel on the other hand can last 7 to 10 years, so for me going with a diesel is a no brainer. (and I intend no offence to anyone by saying that)

 

Second, OnStar!! Did you know that if your vehicle is equipped with OnStar, even if your do not subscribe to the service, can still be shut down by the OnStar system?? Yea there's something to consider, it's integrated into later model vehicles and can not be removed, and can not ever be completely disabled and still leave the vehicle in operable condition despite some claims you may find online. Currently even Leon Panetta has warned us about the potential for terrorists cyber attacks, and IF I were a cyber terrorist I sure as heck would be hacking the OnStar system, look how many cars and light trucks you could just take down with just a mouse click. (just something to consider)

 

Lastly, just about everything made in the last 20 years has electronic fuel injection, even the diesels. Now I am no expert on EMP's (Electro Magnetic Pulse) but if it can disrupt everything electrical it only makes sense to me that the computerized electronic fuel systems could also be taken out by an EMP. I may well be wrong on that, but,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

No I'm not being paranoid or trying to scare anyone. Just offering the point of view of an old school mechanic.

 

I blend in just fine with my old box body K30 crew cab dually, it gets 16mpg no matter what I seem to do with it, and I get the occasional nice compliment because it looks nice. I did have an activist accuse me of killing a rain forest at a gas station a few years back but I laugh at those folks anyway. But there are no fancy electronics to fail, diesel lasts a long time, and worst case scenario it can be easily push started so long as it's pointed down hill. LoL

 

But in a nut shell it all boils down to each persons comfort level and taste. I'm not at all trying to imply there is such a thing as a wrong BOV, it's a matter of choosing what is RIGHT for you to keep you in your own comfort zone. Maybe your just worried about a hurricane, what I have would probably be over kill for you. So my suggestion is first figure out how bad you really believe things could get and plan around that, once you have done that you know will then know if you want something mild like the Jeep Liberty or Grand Cherokee (my GC is a 97 and I love it) or if you want to get as serious as I am and go for something beastly.

 

Now, hopefully I worded that right so as not to offend anyone or step on any toes.

I'm just trying to pass along some of what I know and believe for everyone to consider.

Edited by Dr K30

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Something else that has been on my mind the last couple of days with the EMP theory is transmission issues.

 

Even with a older diesel engine that uses an injection pump rather than the newer electronic injection, many of the automatic overdrive transmissions rely on some electronics. Even the last of the GM700r4's used a throttle position sensor to control the lock up torque converter. So if an EMP were to take out that part of the system on those the torque converter would fail to function properly causing the transmission to over heat and fail. (when you may need it the most)

 

After that GM went to the electronic shifting 4L60E and 4L80E, Ford uses the E4OD (also shifted by a electronics) and Dodge used a variety or transmission models all of which were electronically controlled. Now while each of these has a built in default "Limp Home" mode in case of an electronic failure they will not hold up to being operated like that for very long. It may well get you to your BOL, but if you trash your BOV just getting there you might find yourself up a certain creek without a paddle.

 

As I said before, I only know a little about EMP's, and while I understand the basics on these transmissions I am not a transmission specialist by any means. But it is food for thought and something I plan to do a bit of research on when I have time.

 

And by all means, if you know something I don't, speak up. I'm just thinking out loud here and raising a concern I feel is worth exploring.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The electronic systems are great as long as they are working properly and are not masking some mechanical problem. That said....if EMP or failure of said part(s) in a SHTF situation most will be between a rock and a hard place. Without the proper tools and knowledge there is no good way to fix the problem. Saying that I would think there could be some work arounds for some things. I remember that when they first came out with the lock up convertors some guys were using them with a toggle switch as a sort of two speed splitter? for their trucks when pulling a trailer.....perhaps could be used if sensor failed. The question of the effect of EMP on vehicles seems to be unanswered but assuming the worst case all of the electronic controled systems would be either dead or compromised. The real problem other than fuel will be finding vehicles with mechanical systems that are still servicable. Too much of the old stuff has already gone to the crusher. Plus many "up grade" their old school rides to the new tech which may prove a got cha at some point in the future.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Partsman, I couldn't agree more.

And I have given thought to trying to explain how to do a toggle for the converter, but anymore there are so many variables between different models, and those with the electronic shift control it would be pointless for.

 

And I'm fortunate in many ways by residing at my BOL, and having the skills to service or even build my own BOV. The old box body diesel Chevy's that have not been adulterated are getting really hard to find but they are out there, and I have room to collect and store spare parts and a few spare vehicles even. And the beauty part is the only electrical parts that could fail and leave me stranded are the fuel cut off in the Stanadyne injection pump (easily bypassed if you know what your doing) and the starter for which I am trying to piece together a pneumatic starter. And no, running out of air is not a problem so long as you have a C/02 tank for a backup.

 

But that's me and my situation, and at least until SHTF I'm concerned about others who may not have the luxury of their own parts cache or will be at the mercy of the more modern stuff.

 

What we need here in this country is the old Nissan Patrol, Oz still have quite a few running around but none were sold here new. They were light, had a inline 6 turbo diesel, 5 speed manual transmission, and take just about anything you can dish out so long as you don't over heat it or run it out of oil. I would love to have one myself except for the right hand drive, but not a good BOV for the states because if you did break it there are not many parts available pre SHTF, after that point you would be SOL if anything happened to it. But they are a blast to drive in the back country!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Great ideas. Keep them coming.

 

I am not so concerned about emp. My biggest issue is space for people. I need something that can get 9 family member and that doesn't include my prepper friends. I need enough space for at least 20. I was looking in to a set of these. http://www.quadvan.com/new-4x4-vans-ford-dropship.html

 

Gives me the space, most the capability I need.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's darn sure an option if your not worried about EMP.

But, be sure you do one thing, the Ford e4od has a bad history of overheating and burping it's fluid out the front seal. So be sure you get the biggest aftermarket transmission cooler you can get installed on it.

 

As for this over heat issue, it doesn't seem to hurt the seal when it does it, but ya gotta keep fluid in it. Prime example is when I had to get someone out of Kemah when Rita was coming I had a Ford F350 crew cab dually, it took me less than 3 hours to get to Kemah, and 18 hours plus 2 cases of transmission fluid to get home pulling a 25' travel trailer. After the first 10 hours of moving 10 feet and stopping I was running out of fluid and started putting it into neutral as soon as traffic started stopping and only putting it in gear when it was tome to move. This allowed the trans to run cool enough not to burp out it's fluid.

 

I should also note that was NOT a rebuilt transmission but a factory replacement trans that had only been in the truck a month. I bought it because all of the rebuilt transmissions I got did the exact same thing. I also sold that truck the next week because I was tired of dealing with that one issue.

 

And maybe we need to push getting the word out for those who find themselves in an evacuation situation like that where there is heavy and barely moving traffic, if it's an automatic transmission of any make it will stay cooler and give less problems if you simply slip it into neutral when your stopped. I know your arm will get darn tired, mine sure did, but it could be the difference between getting there or breaking down.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dr K30,

 

That is great stuff to know about the Ford tranny issues. There are so many issues to consider for the vechile you purchase and your community. The biggest issue is getting a BOL all setup before you need to use that vehicle.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Very true, thus why I live where I do.

 

And there is probably a lot more I can contribute as time allows.

 

There is one more thought on the Ford transmissions, if your running the 6.9/7.3 diesel engine, these were also used in many school buses mated up to the Allison A4 or A5 transmission. One option is to go with the Allison automatic (easy enough conversion for a mechanic) and if it's in a 4x4 you simply need to use what is called a divorced transfer case. Now we are talking a chunk of change, all your drive shafts would need to be modified, and you loose over drive and some fuel mileage. But you also loose the electronic shift control and gain the automatic transmission from hell that will take some serious abuse.

 

The Allison A4 and A5 was also used with some Chevrolet engines in buses and medium duty trucks, meaning if your lucky enough to get your hands on what you need it is possible to bolt the Allison to just about any Chevy diesel or gas engine, but again you would loose over drive and have to have all new drive shafts modified. BUT, when I say many, that is limited to pretty much pre 1992 for gas engines due to the fact that the electronics from the transmission are interconnected with the ones that run the engine and that starts a whole new ball game.

 

Now the Allison conversion is probably not something you want to do unless your as extreme as I am. And if you are, quit being lazy and just go find what you want with a manual transmission!!! :P

 

Seriously, both the BOL and BOV need to be high priorities and thought out carefully. And radical alterations are not always the best answer. Lift kits are a prime example, you have to look at what is gained by what is lost and measure if it's really necessary for your needs. For some instances a lift kit is great, crossing streams and what have ya, but it also makes it more top heavy and more likely to roll during a high speed maneuver.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The other question I had is how many people are you trying to bring/care for.

Unfortunetly I am from a very large family. Fathers side is 60+. Now I am not saying that I am brining all of them with me, But there is at least 25 people in my survival group.

 

To carry all those people and supplies I would need 2 box trucks and two E350.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would look into a school bus, and yea, I'm dead serious.

 

Look for a late 80's to early 90's model Ford or international with the 7.3 diesel engine. And if your thinking no offroad capabilities think again. Some tire chains and a good stout winch on front and the only thing left to worry about is the fact the back hangs over the rear axle quite a bit.

 

Now it is top heavy, it ain't fast either, but believe it or not they have more center ground clearance than most pickups and with tire chains get around pretty darn good so long as you can transverse any dips that might cause the rear bumper to hang up. and when you can't, fire up the winch.

 

We used the hell out of one on a deer some years back, we laughed at it at first but it surprised all of us.

 

Oh yea, they only came with a choice of a Spicer 5 speed manual or the Allison automatic, both of which are good, tough, reliable transmissions.

 

And finding one with a handicap lift isn't that hard either and can also be used for loading supplies. And you can also build a HUGE Safari rack to go on the roof.

 

If I had 25 people to BO with that would be my first choice, then again if you can get an old Military 6x6 with troop transport benches. But, the bus will give you about 10mpg loaded where the 6x6 might give you 6mpg empty. Last but not least, if you needed parts there are tens of thousands of those buses around, where would you find parts for a old military truck after TSHTF??

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I only have 20 acres, but the east side is adjacent to a 240 acre ranch that is just a get away for the owner, and across the south fence is 1700 acres that has a couple of oil wells and maybe 50 head of cattle. It's all brush country at the end of a dirt road off another dirt road, 3.5 miles to the closest asphalt.

 

I also have 2 like minded (for the most part) neighbors who are ok and one that is totally expendable if he gets in my way at all. Other than that it's over 5 miles to the next residence. And like most of south Texas it's over run with feral hogs, we kill 3 or 4 a month just for the freezer, but that also means the garden will need 24 hour guarding. Even that there is a plan for by giving the night shift to the weakest link, he (in this case) wouldn't do well working the garden or doing many of the physical chores but can stand tower watch at night and sleep during the day.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Had another "Interesting " thought about the school bus that would make it like a darn tank.

 

First, the bus would need to be equipped with air brakes, not a problem since most are anyway.

 

Then comes in some creativity, go find a truck (as in big rig) salvage yard and tell them you want to put a twin screw with axle interlocks on your old school bus. Once they stop laughing you can probably even talk them into doing the work if your not able to do it your self. But that would give you tandem axles in the back with all tires pulling when you flip the interlock air valve.

 

Stay with 20 inch wheels and you can find some surplus military heavy lug tires for it.

 

Once you have all of that done and the extra carrying capacity that will naturally come with it, there is nothing between the frame and outer body on either side except one fuel tank that may hold up to 75 gallons. So you might also see what that salvage yard can do for you there, no reason why you couldn't have about 500 gallons worth of fuel tanks, which should give you plenty of fuel reserve to tide you over for a bit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Had another "Interesting " thought about the school bus that would make it like a darn tank.

 

First, the bus would need to be equipped with air brakes, not a problem since most are anyway.

 

Then comes in some creativity, go find a truck (as in big rig) salvage yard and tell them you want to put a twin screw with axle interlocks on your old school bus. Once they stop laughing you can probably even talk them into doing the work if your not able to do it your self. But that would give you tandem axles in the back with all tires pulling when you flip the interlock air valve.

 

Stay with 20 inch wheels and you can find some surplus military heavy lug tires for it.

 

Once you have all of that done and the extra carrying capacity that will naturally come with it, there is nothing between the frame and outer body on either side except one fuel tank that may hold up to 75 gallons. So you might also see what that salvage yard can do for you there, no reason why you couldn't have about 500 gallons worth of fuel tanks, which should give you plenty of fuel reserve to tide you over for a bit.

Reminds me of Mad Max when "they had hidden all the precious juice in the vehicles" and Max got left behind with a tanker truck full of sand lol.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

LoL Yea I remember that!! But this one we prep properly and hide the "juice" along the frame rails leaving the inside clear for gear and people. ;)

 

Actually, I'm trying to chase down a lead on an old 6x6 chassis, if I get it I may pick up an old school bus and build a real Mad Max special complete with snorkel and stack and powered with something like a 400 Cat diesel, that way I can drown 75 passengers and still drive the bus out of the lake!!

Seriously, it could come in real handy in a rescue operation such as they have going on after Sandy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Our bug out group consists of 3 generations of family. We have a mechanic, nurse, and EMT. Most of us have been hunters of some form or another and we all know how to handle a firearm. We have four BOV in our group; one is a Chevy crew cab dually with a 454, our pushing and pulling vehicle, we have 2 4x4's and one AWD. They are all daily drivers. They are all equiped with defensive equipment, all vehicles have 1 oil slick and 3 rounds of road spikes plus each vehicle comes with its own unique defense. Those of us who are not medical or mechanical are the guards of our BOL which is still in the process of being built. Our BOL is on 2 acres in the woods with a small lake near by. Our supplies are divided umong all our vehicles that way if one breaks down we can abandon it in a pinch and lose little and if we have time we can quickly unload all supplies into the other vehicles and abandon the vehicle.

 

Now how to protect yourself from an EMP. Look up faraday cage on google. It is basically a metal cage that is grounded and it will protect anything inside it from an EMP. This metal cage does not have to be open it could be a metal drum or how about a completely enclosed metal garage like the one in the following link http://www.powerbiltbuildings.com/our-buildings/building-uses/workshops/ be sure if you have window that they are covered with wire mesh. Also be sure to use metal doors and not the fiberglass ones. Cargo shipping containers would work well also.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd be leaving from a rural area if I had to leave, so my situation is different than some. Also vehicles with upgrades like heavy duty bumpers are still gray in ranch country.

 

Here are things I see as necessary.

-limited slip or locking rear differential.

-good all-terrain or mud tires

-good full size spare, 12V air compressor, plug kit

-full size cab (you can use a rifle from a full size truck pretty effectively)

-heavy duty replacement bumper/grill guard (not for looks, truly stout and attached to the frame)

-auxillary fuel tank (I have 40-50 gallon reserve tanks in my toolboxes for my diesels)

-jumper pack that is actually big enough to jump the vehicle it's in, with 12V recharging

-radio communication with other vehicles in your group

 

My current one is a 1 ton 4x4 crew cab diesel with all these options and others. It gets around 17mpg on the highway and is still capable off road. I have a flatbed on it, but have a box built to put on the flatbed for concealed lockable storage of food and gear. It can also pull the trailers for the UTV or horses if needed. My EMP plan is the horse trailer behind the 77 chevy 4x4, but it only gets 4-6mpg.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recent Topics

  • Posts

    • HELLO! WELCOME TO THE GREAT TEMPLE OF ILLUMINATI WORLD RICHES. Are you a business Man, politician, musical, student and you want to be rich, powerful and be famous in life. You can achieve your dreams by being a member of the Illuminati brotherhood, and receive a monthly salary of $500,000 USD. We are ready to change your life, we can make your Dreams come true, also we are going to give you everything that you need in this Life .... *Riches  *Power *Famous *Wealth  With this all your dreams and heart desire can be fully accomplish,So have you make up your mind that you want to join the great Illuminati brotherhood to become rich and famous in life population and also you will be protected from all evils against you and your family.
      If you're really ready to be a member of the great Illuminati Brotherhood then contact us via WhatsApp:  +1 315 203 9948 or our official Email: {officialilluminati999@gmail.com} Visits our Websites for more info: https://illuminatiofficial666world.wordpress.com
       
    • HELLO! WELCOME TO THE GREAT TEMPLE OF ILLUMINATI WORLD RICHES. Are you a business Man, politician, musical, student and you want to be rich, powerful and be famous in life. You can achieve your dreams by being a member of the Illuminati brotherhood, and receive a monthly salary of $500,000 USD. We are ready to change your life, we can make your Dreams come true, also we are going to give you everything that you need in this Life .... *Riches  *Power *Famous *Wealth  With this all your dreams and heart desire can be fully accomplish,So have you make up your mind that you want to join the great Illuminati brotherhood to become rich and famous in life population and also you will be protected from all evils against you and your family.
      If you're really ready to be a member of the great Illuminati Brotherhood then contact us via WhatsApp:  +1 315 203 9948 or our official Email: {officialilluminati999@gmail.com} Visits our Websites for more info: https://illuminatiofficial666world.wordpress.com
       
    • INSTEAD OF GETTING A LOAN,,  I GOT SOMETHING NEW
      Get $5,500 USD every day, for six months! See how it works
      Do you know you can hack into any ATM machine with a hacked ATM card??
      Make up you mind before applying, straight deal... Order for a blank ATM card now and get millions within a week!: contact us
      via email address::{Universalcardshackers@gmail.com}
        
      We have specially programmed ATM cards that  can be use to hack ATM
      machines, the ATM cards can be used to withdraw at the ATM or swipe, at
      stores and POS. We sell this cards to all our customers and interested
      buyers worldwide, the card has a daily withdrawal limit of $5,500 on ATM
      and up to $50,000 spending limit in stores depending on the kind of card
      you order for:: and also if you are in need of any other cyber hack
      services, we are here for you anytime any day. Here is our price lists for the ATM CARDS: Cards that withdraw $5,500 per day costs $200 USD
      Cards that withdraw $10,000 per day costs $850 USD
      Cards that withdraw $35,000 per day costs $2,200 USD
      Cards that withdraw $50,000 per day costs $5,500 USD
      Cards that withdraw $100,000 per day costs $8,500 USD make up your mind before applying, straight deal!!! The price include shipping fees and charges, order now: contact us via
      email address:: {Universalcardshackers@gmail.com} Visit our Website for more Info: https://automatictellers.webs.com
      ®
    • INSTEAD OF GETTING A LOAN,,  I GOT SOMETHING NEW
      Get $5,500 USD every day, for six months! See how it works
      Do you know you can hack into any ATM machine with a hacked ATM card??
      Make up you mind before applying, straight deal... Order for a blank ATM card now and get millions within a week!: contact us
      via email address::{Universalcardshackers@gmail.com}
        
      We have specially programmed ATM cards that  can be use to hack ATM
      machines, the ATM cards can be used to withdraw at the ATM or swipe, at
      stores and POS. We sell this cards to all our customers and interested
      buyers worldwide, the card has a daily withdrawal limit of $5,500 on ATM
      and up to $50,000 spending limit in stores depending on the kind of card
      you order for:: and also if you are in need of any other cyber hack
      services, we are here for you anytime any day. Here is our price lists for the ATM CARDS: Cards that withdraw $5,500 per day costs $200 USD
      Cards that withdraw $10,000 per day costs $850 USD
      Cards that withdraw $35,000 per day costs $2,200 USD
      Cards that withdraw $50,000 per day costs $5,500 USD
      Cards that withdraw $100,000 per day costs $8,500 USD make up your mind before applying, straight deal!!! The price include shipping fees and charges, order now: contact us via
      email address:: {Universalcardshackers@gmail.com} Visit our Website for more Info: https://automatictellers.webs.com
      ®
    • INSTEAD OF GETTING A LOAN,,  I GOT SOMETHING NEW
      Get $5,500 USD every day, for six months! See how it works
      Do you know you can hack into any ATM machine with a hacked ATM card??
      Make up you mind before applying, straight deal... Order for a blank ATM card now and get millions within a week!: contact us
      via email address::{Universalcardshackers@gmail.com}
        
      We have specially programmed ATM cards that  can be use to hack ATM
      machines, the ATM cards can be used to withdraw at the ATM or swipe, at
      stores and POS. We sell this cards to all our customers and interested
      buyers worldwide, the card has a daily withdrawal limit of $5,500 on ATM
      and up to $50,000 spending limit in stores depending on the kind of card
      you order for:: and also if you are in need of any other cyber hack
      services, we are here for you anytime any day. Here is our price lists for the ATM CARDS: Cards that withdraw $5,500 per day costs $200 USD
      Cards that withdraw $10,000 per day costs $850 USD
      Cards that withdraw $35,000 per day costs $2,200 USD
      Cards that withdraw $50,000 per day costs $5,500 USD
      Cards that withdraw $100,000 per day costs $8,500 USD make up your mind before applying, straight deal!!! The price include shipping fees and charges, order now: contact us via
      email address:: {Universalcardshackers@gmail.com} Visit our Website for more Info: https://automatictellers.webs.com
      ®