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Captain, as alwasy thank you for the insights. Personally I don't have to have that life or death situation with everyone I meet because illinois doesn't make it too easy to obtain a carry permit. I wish the ruling class was more terrified of me so that they would do a better job keeping this country a great country

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Greece has been it turmoil since 5 may 2010


now this is in a civilized country and money is still available as in unemployment and some are being

subsidized by their union or the socialist party or labor unions, until the money runs out.


If we analyze the depression it actually started in 1920 - 1921 the economy bounced and was doing

what ours is doing now for some years then in 29 it flopped..


There is no formal definition of economic depression, but two informal rules are a 10% decline in GDP or a recession lasting more than three years.{so now what are you thinking}


as I have stated in my rants / posts we are in a totally different situation.

in the 20's our country was 60+ percent farms ranches and orchards and timber these people knew

how to live off the land and most never owed a car and horses were still being used to haul and deliver

milk cheese / dairy beer and trash as well as other duties, in fact WWI 1914 to 1918 horses and mules

were used quite a bit.


we have no such cheap labor today horses work for hay water and some medical preventive care

I can remember ox teams in Europe and horses.

Today I heard from 2 sources on TV they expect next year to be the intersection of our printing

money and the IMF witch is us to help {print more money} to bail out Europe.

If you ask why? it is the real fear that 20% + of our economy comes from sales to Europe

Imagine if tomorrow your boss cuts your pay 20% or SSI or food stamps it does not mater

everyone will take a hit unemployment will double the number now is a blatant lie 9% is the ones

still on unemployment once your benefits run out your are not considered unemployed so you are

not part of that 9% number.


now 20 to 25% unemployment and Occupy wall street will look like a small block party.

in1920 the population was well under 1/2 million for all the burrows and even near by area

it is now over 8 million, imagine 1.6 million unemployed who need to eat go to the bathroom

and drink just consider that alone every day 1.6 million gallons of water .8 million pounds of food

and that much urine and fecal matter to dispose of and that does not include baths or anything else

and these are survival rations an Ethiopian eats more than that.


first where is this food going to come from in a panic situation there would be no food in 4 hours

in the whole city water would be the only way that the police or military would have any control.

riots is not the word for what is going to happen it will look more like the French revolution

but more insane.


now consider all the major cities of the U.S. in this same condition the zombie apocalypse will look

like church function WWII will look like a minor scuffle, American are like no other people on earth

we have proven that the civil war killed more people 620,000 in a time when we had single shot rifles

and pistols and knifes and swords 400,000 of these died from disease and shelling etc...


If you think like a friend of mine that the governments will all play nice and come to some agreement

you may be right but our money will be virtually worthless only the 1%, millionaires will be the only

ones who will be able to afford anything, maybe...


so what about those 35,000 gangs and 2.5 million convicts and I can only guess on parolees

mental cases and 10% take medication for mental disorders now add 20% unemployed

released military who won't be able to find jobs and the government won't have the money to

pay them..


I hope you feel all warm and fuzzy now

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An excellent post as usual from the survival mom. Thanks for sharing it.




We have spent the last 4 decades teaching our kids that there is no morality, no God, no need to deny ourselves instant gratification, "if it feels good do it", they are OWED what they want and are ENTITLED to it even if someone else already owns it. I do not wonder at crap like this. I am amazed that the clown with the "big black semi-automatic gun" seems to think that I won't have a "big black semi-automatic gun" of my own with which to discuss his planned acquisitions but then the schools don't teach logical thinking, do they?





I'd also bet he is of the "spray and pray" mentality for combat operations. These clowns are why it is so important to live gray. I do not want to ever have to kill another human being. I'd rather stay gray and be left alone. The trouble with the 'gun fighter' mentality is that you can never stop once you start and your life expectancy is very short. There is always someone faster, better or just plain luckier than you are. When you meet that person, you lose.


There is a level of ostentation that I think is useful - the folks in New Orleans who manned the barricade to their subdivision with the "looters will be shot" signs maybe saved some poor, misguided soul from making a fatal mistake after Katrina. On the other hand, too much of that and the imported cops show up in force to confiscate the guns. I do note that although I heard of them taking the guns from individuals, I don't ever recall them trying to disarm any of these groups. They may have been walking on peoples' rights but they weren't stupid.


A fine line to try and walk but if done correctly it might save lives; yours or theirs. I also put the shop keeper firmly in the Mall Ninja category. These are the clowns who think it is cool to kill because they've played video games and they're good at it or they think it makes them sound/look tough. If they ever run into a real warrior they'd lose big time; they are just so unthinking that they think everything will play out as they image it with them as Mad Max. They have no idea how much physical, mental and emotional training it takes to make a decent soldier. Even if they were in the military it was long enough ago they have forgotten what basic training was like. They should read "the Hobbit". Adventures almost never turn out as we plan. They are always more uncomfortable than expected and take a much larger toll on us than we thought.


I never wanted to kill anyone but my first tour in Iraq it happened. A car was comming up on my patrol while we were dismounted and I was pulling security around the corner from my humvee. I was in the shadows where he couldnt see me, so I stepped out and flashed my Tac LIght at him to get him to stop. He slowed down but continued towards me. My heart started racing. I fired a warning shot next to his door, but he still kept comming. By this time, it felt like an hour had passed in a split second, I considered trying to disable his car with a shot to the engine, but he was close enough to coast too near the patrol. I sighted in on the windshield just slightly above his head and pulled the trigger. The car swerved to a stop and hit a building. The impact was enough to move the driver off the dead mans switch he was sitting on. My point of this story is, for me, it was incredibly easy to kill another human being. We are wired for survival, society has taught us certain things are wrong. I say this not because I would become a predator, but because some who have lesser morales will not think twice. Always be on guard when you come across another person/ group.

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Part One: I believe after all the initial work of filling tubs etc is taken care of, my best course would be to "go average". Be careful to act like everyone else... there is anonymity in numbers. Then ease ourselves into oblivion by disconnecting visible light and sound sources and just quietly live unobserved. If there is red cross or whatever handing out supplies-we will be there too. Not going would draw attention to us.


Part 2: No- I would not take from others, assuming they need the stuff also. Now if I happen across a bad guy (defined looter, or worse) who was slower than me, thats another story.

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Guest Hitman
Bonus question: In a SHTF or TEOTWAWKI event, would you EVER take something from someone else if you didn't have that item and you needed it?


Absolutely not!! Trade for it, absolutely so. "I would not "take" anything! I'd do without. I'm humble, but prepared. (Adapt and Overcome)! Where'd I hear that I wonder?


By having utitilites, "probably nothing". If utilities were gone it'd be different!


1) Constantly monitor the situation. Hamm or emergency radio. Check supplies

and prepare for defense.


2) 7-14 days iron bars go on the steel doors and wndows. (If event is real.)


3) 10-14 days without. Stairs for the upper deck access to the house come off. Easily replaced.

With no access to upper deck, no one should be there. It would be a warning.

Put out driveway monitors in locations for early warning detection.


4) No one goes out without alarm system being set behind them. Alarm system always on.

It won't be monitored but the audible will still work.


5) Begin prepping for bug out scenario.

Edited by Hitman

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I think for 2 weeks my family could survive well enough, especially with utilities.


As far as the bonus question.... I have a wife and 3 girls. If they are starving and I cant hunt, fish, scavenge, or gather food and water for them I will ask anyone who has some very nicely. I will go to great lengths to somehow barter or attain them sustenance without resorting to violence, but in the end if its their lives or yours then sorry bud. You gotta go. Can you imagine looking into your childs eyes as they cramp from starvation pains and really say you wouldnt do anything to get them some food? Honestly think about watching your kids starve to death. Would you kill to save their lives? I know I would. No ones life is more important then theirs.


I'm sure I will get all kinds of crap for saying that but I'm just trying to keep it real. Humans are just another animal living on this planet and like many other animals we will do just about whatever it takes to ensure the survival of ourselves and our offspring. The baser instincts take over and the real beast comes out.

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I think for 2 weeks my family could survive well enough, especially with utilities.


As far as the bonus question.... I have a wife and 3 girls. If they are starving and I cant hunt, fish, scavenge, or gather food and water for them I will ask anyone who has some very nicely. I will go to great lengths to somehow barter or attain them sustenance without resorting to violence, but in the end if its their lives or yours then sorry bud. You gotta go. Can you imagine looking into your childs eyes as they cramp from starvation pains and really say you wouldnt do anything to get them some food? Honestly think about watching your kids starve to death. Would you kill to save their lives? I know I would. No ones life is more important then theirs.


I'm sure I will get all kinds of crap for saying that but I'm just trying to keep it real. Humans are just another animal living on this planet and like many other animals we will do just about whatever it takes to ensure the survival of ourselves and our offspring. The baser instincts take over and the real beast comes out.[/quote

You will not catch any crap from me sir that is basically how I feel and I am a family man myself. There are basically two opinions so far on this thread yours and mine and those who say they would not take anything from someone else. Now, I agree with them if there is a riot situation or some short lived event where you could hurt others for supplies but there really isn't a need too if you have some supplies already at home. Then there is a long drawn out event that might make us use up all of our supplies. If that is the case and there is no hope on the horizon of help then that is the case where you and I completly agree, I will never look into the eyes of my family memebers who are dying of hunger or whatever and not do something about it because of pride or a principle of not wanting to be the "bad" guy.

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If that is the case, then the only thing different between you and someone unprepared is how long your preparations will last.


I don't want to ever be in that position.

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Now this is more like it! I like the real world scenario you propse, mental practice at its best. Given unilities are still available I'm staying put in the Straydog Compound! I have a substacial water storage program in house and inhome purification system, but also have a well in the yard with 12 volt pump and a creek just behind the fence, but I'd still go immediately into storeage mode filling every possible container I could find before the valve shuts off. As long as the lights are on, everything rerchargable goes on the plug. Two weeks hold up inside would not be an issue from a resource standpoint. I have a reasonable supply of fire wood should the gas valve close as well. Under certain circumstances my place is first rally point for a few others who've contributed and trained. The house was purchaced a few years ago for its "grey" location and securable characteristics; no low windows, storage space , no large glass exterior sections/doors. and NOT total electric. After purchace, all entry points were upgraded to having an exterior and an interior door(enclosed porches). Bonus! The dead air space these "vestibules" provided, cut heating an cooling costs substancially, as well as added security. bear in mind, I have been of the prepared mindset for decades. I did not ddecide to do this because of the latest "Holy Shit Batman, what if craze". I do not have an armory of the latest high tech gear and semi auto weaponery, but I do have the resources, training and supplies to PROTECT my family, myself and my property. Make no mistake, I am NOT the "go to guy" in this type pf situation. If you are not "prepared" family or part of the "prepared" team, don't bother knocking. I'm NOT the Red Cross, Salvation Army, or FEMA.

As for your question of wheather I'd take from someone something I didn't have and needed. Providing we confine ourselves to "this two week scenario" NO. I would not become a part of the problem. However, if I was forced to dispatch an aggressor, their resorces would be "repurposed", given time allowed for it. Outside this given scenario, once the decision to leave is made and on property resource cache is complete things take on a different posture. Other than prearranged rally points with family and team members, there are no friendlies while enroute to BOL, period.

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